SPEAKER_00: as the president of the internet i'm going to or as president uh in when's the next election 2028 uh as your as jcal 2028 i'm signing an executive order that all self-driving cars have to publicly

SPEAKER_05: release the video within 24 hours of an accident if there is a person getting hit obviously blur it out if it's too graphic but people should be able to see it with the freedom of information act or

SPEAKER_07: after seeing it actually after seeing a disclaimer maybe blurring out the person's face it's you know

SPEAKER_09: like if even if i got hit by a car i would want people to see it to know the truth i'm trying to think about a privacy issue but you might want to blur out my face and not see me this week in

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SPEAKER_05: try it for free today at notion.com twist all right everybody welcome back to this week in startups i'm your host jason calacanis with my co-hosts here lon harris and alex not albrecht that's dignation

SPEAKER_14: alex wilhelm different uh different alex but i always think about alex wilhelm alex albrecht

SPEAKER_05: got a lot of stuff in the news i want to get right to it um and the number one story god there's so many number one stories i know probably today was crazy got in an accident that's an important issue for me number two co2 is going to do a new venture fund that's an open-ended fund where you put in as little as 50k very interesting could have an impact fiverr's ceo gave an ai warning basically told everybody in the company you know hey things are changing uh you got to bring your a-game and uber had their earnings they crushed it again uh almost to an all-time high woohoo uh and they're making

SPEAKER_22: everybody go back to work did we cover that story already the uber earnings no the uber rto we haven't talked about either okay the uber rto i think is super important the nso group the people who make

SPEAKER_05: that hacking software pegasus or whatever that is they got fined for hacking i guess apple apple and google search there's something going on there where they're going to lose the search deal these are the things i'm seeing alex which of these stories that i mentioned

SPEAKER_00: is the most important story i'm just curious your editorial judgment which one do you think is the

SPEAKER_25: most important and let's do it the most important one is the co2 story i think we have to start with

SPEAKER_00: start with the money all i know about is wall street journal story that michael dell's family office and jeff bezos are anchoring this one billion dollar fund that there's a minimum uh fit there's a very low minimum so accredited investors i believe is where you have to be 50 000 but i know when i raise a fund there's a cap and the cap on an investment fund for venture is 99 investors or

SPEAKER_03: up to 10 million so when i did my last fund for accredited investors people make like 150 200k a year i can have like 10 million worth of those but i had demand for 120 million of those but that's just the rules venture capital firms can't do this but this is doing a different fund structure which i think is the main piece we have to get into just going over the fund itself this is an interesting

SPEAKER_31: vehicle jason it's going to target both public and private high growth technology companies so the reason why i think this is so interesting for our audience is that it could maybe democratize venture capital and allow a greater pool of people to put capital into a fund that will back private market companies and i went ahead and polled co2's known 2025 investments per crunch base and they've taken part in uh fundings for harvey together ai mercury the bank island the secure browser super base in their labs clara persona lots of twist 100 companies so you can see they're getting deal flow right so now lawn might be able to with 150k check get access to a lot of really interesting private market shares so your question how is this possible i spent more time today in sec finalists than i want to admit i i have to say i think you owe me lunch because oh my lord um but as far as i can tell with my research and really abusing uh chat gpt for oh the gist is this is not like a traditional venture capital fund it's called a registered closed end interval fund that's kind of the moniker

SPEAKER_00: attached to it registered closed end interval fund yes okay so we have to unpack that and explaining and playing english to our audience i understand that part of this is it's like an ipo and you have to do

David Friedberg: higher reporting and people can redeem their money on some regular basis i think that's the yes you're

SPEAKER_31: you're dead on redemptions and this will be quarterly up to five percent of the funds value no more than that so i guess if someone else cashes out before you and hits the five percent that's it for you also if you take your money out in the first year you pay a two percent premium oh sorry two percent penalty on that now uh the continuously offered fund i believe it means that it's going to last for as long as it wants to there's no set end date to it jason and this is a a fund that has been registered under the sec form in two now it's different than vcs and i have a chart i'll pull up in a second showing the discrepancies between this and a trad venture fund but the reason why i think they chose this format is because it doesn't have a investor cap so the caps we know about spvs or traditional venture funds simply don't apply here and that's kind of where it gets a little murky and i actually want to call an accountant to bring them on the show to break down the deepest nuances here but

SPEAKER_05: i think you've got the broad strokes if you're doing an spv or a venture fund you can have 99 investors

Chamath Palihapitiya: say in this spv special purpose vehicle or your venture fund and it's uncapped so 99 people put a million dollars in each or 50k if you want to have more than that they can do a lower amount but then they cap it at 10 million so i did that because i wanted people to be able to put in 25 50 or 100k into our last phone like friends of mine etc this is all in the weeds but more people will have access and then registered um uh financial advisors people want to get into alternates so this is opening

SPEAKER_49: up a whole nother group of people to invest in venture capital overall i think it's a great thing

SPEAKER_51: i i think it's an absolutely great thing and i know that it's going to be enticing to people because as i was reading this i was like oh should we do this thinking about my family and i was like

SPEAKER_54: oh wait that'd be the biggest conflict of interest known to man as someone who's still a journalist

SPEAKER_56: like he you don't know you know why because you wouldn't even know what's in the fund it would be

SPEAKER_05: like buying an index fund so you would just be putting 50k and you wouldn't know what you have and you know i'm sure they would send reporting that would but you could just say listen i i don't make the investment decisions here so if i if they bought i don't know solana or they bought stripe you

SPEAKER_60: wouldn't even know if the president can make his own meme coins you alex should be able to invest in

SPEAKER_31: this all right lon i i love you and i appreciate you throwing me a bone there but i do aspire to a slightly higher moral and ethical bar than the current president who's doing meme coin meetups

SPEAKER_56: there's your problem right there alex i'm gonna go ahead and give you permission

SPEAKER_49: to understand what i learned about 10 years ago no conflict no interest i'm an uber shareholder

SPEAKER_31: and i have opinions on uber i want to make one more note though in the weeds about why doesn't everybody do what co2 is doing here with this funks it sounds kind of like too good to be true no cap on investors the difference is there's a lot more sec overhead jason you have to do audited financials and reporting and such and there's a cool thing called the venture capital exemption that allows vcs to raise funds without actually registering as rigorously with the sec so this does not have

SPEAKER_54: the paperwork advantages it takes on lots more work but with some other advantages now there were

SPEAKER_00: also fees for this yes and the carry is different so take us through the you know typical carry you get

SPEAKER_03: 20 carry so whatever the gain if the if the fund made a billion dollars the partners would get 200 million let's say it returned two billion one billion is the original amount two billion is what gets returned you would get 20 of the gain so 20 of a billion is 200 million plus you we get two percent

Chamath Palihapitiya: a year perhaps one and a half percent uh each year for 10 years 12 years whatever that is so if it's a billion dollar fund you get 15 20 million dollars a year run the team that you know and those and those come out of the gains of that 200 million in carry so you have to recoup those but you you

SPEAKER_00: get them in advance those those are called management okay so what are the what's the story here

SPEAKER_51: with kochi okay so two main things to know first of all the fee is lower than two percent it's one

SPEAKER_31: point two five percent annually significantly lower significantly lower and they will only take twelve and a half percent of the fund's annual profits provided there's a hurdle here jason that they clear five percent profit so essentially if they make less than five percent profit they're not going to take it so to me this is very investor friendly there's a little bit of a catch though when i was going through all the paperwork there are some essentially buying fees if you buy smaller amounts you might pay i think it's two and a half or three and a half percent up front loading fee yeah a load yes it's the load if you buy i think more than 250k or 500k that's obviated but there's actually three classes of shares inside of this targeted at different investor groups blah blah blah but the point is i think the economics here are actually pretty attractive i thought they were going to be brutal because here's exposure you couldn't get otherwise i think this is because lps

Chamath Palihapitiya: are having a bit of burnout and they're seeing that uh maybe venture as a category because of the the wrath of lena khan for four years and the trump tariff turmoil these two things combined i'm you know balls and strikes here i'm not making a political statement i'm just stating facts

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SPEAKER_00: year five of no exits or very few exits what this does is they're going to be able to i suspect they're

SPEAKER_09: not going to go into our business angel investing or seed or you know series a or series b this is going

SPEAKER_83: to be a way for them to buy spacex shares and drill shares stripe shares you know work your way

SPEAKER_00: backwards for the hun top 50 members of the twist 500 and then let it be like uh you know almost

SPEAKER_05: publicly traded stock it's not public but so it's a good idea um and it's a way for people to get exits as well so the venture community might be selling to koto's fund and so this would create like a little

SPEAKER_00: bridge between public markets and private markets so this is a way to provide secondary liquidity to

Chamath Palihapitiya: existing venture funds uh okay before let's say they say oh i really like grin i like palm i like data stacks i like your shares in these companies uh well your stocks just got bought by ibm i think but anyway they're like these companies we have we want to buy some of your shares we would have another person to sell to which would be quite nice yeah uh chamath had a really interesting tweet

SPEAKER_31: about this jason he kind of compared this fund to his existing venture capital lp commits saying that he's kind of done with the traditional setup doesn't like having meager dpi even from really top tier funds do you think we could see a shift of some folks that may have put capital into a trad venture capital fund instead going why bother when i can get redemptions from this fund and just

SPEAKER_05: going all in on the code to offering there's so much money in the world and there's so many new

Chamath Palihapitiya: investors in the world that i think the trend will still be more people investing in venture venture investing in more startups and investing larger amounts of money why sovereign wealth funds are participating in a major way uh and now retail investors in a major way and then globally high net worth individuals globally getting involved in venture in the united states that means the industry is going to continue to grow the returns might be getting a little more muted this is going to be topsy-turvy for a little while in venture until trump stops the tariff stuff settles it by june uh which i think he will and then we will be moving on to uh more m a so yeah it's uh it's

SPEAKER_05: going to be crazy but it's nice to see a little innovation here sure let's go on to zoo well lon what

SPEAKER_97: do you think is the next most important story oh wow uh i i know pressure yeah i i was gonna say yeah either fiver or zooks i think zoo yeah the zooks accident uh was a was an important so uh zooks of course amazon's uh self-driving startup they issued a voluntary recall this week after an incident involving an unoccupied zooks robo taxi hitting a passenger vehicle in las vegas minor injuries to the cars no one was hurt but this was enough for them to recognize that they had this safety issue they issued a uh safety recall report with the national highway traffic safety administration and i believe it was a few hundred zooks uh cars were taken off the road and uh have this software update implemented that is going across all their vehicles and yeah i mean i think the thing to point out here is this is sort of the system working as intended no no one was hurt there was this minor traffic accident that alerted them to a problem they've now fixed the problem and the cars are safer than ever i mean

SPEAKER_60: this is sort of best case scenario in some ways for how the system would would sort of function this was

Chamath Palihapitiya: a car that got cut off the details of the accidents were a quote the incident involved a passenger car quickly approaching the lane where our purpose-built robo taxi was traveling this is apparently from zooks anticipating that the passenger car would proceed forward i guess in cutting off the zooks it sounds like the zooks robotaxi slowed down and steered to the right i guess going into the shoulder instead

SPEAKER_00: the car came to a stop slammed on the brakes fully yielding to the zooks robotaxi remaining in the shoulder lane the zooks robotaxi brake drive but contact was unavoidable so it sounds like maybe the car it's hard from this description to understand what happened i think i understand the i've read it over

SPEAKER_97: so the zooks was traveling a car approached from the right that looked like it was about to come into its lane so the zooks paused but then that car also paused causing the accident rather than proceeding into the lane so it was a situation where the robo taxi only failed because it failed to inaccurately guess how the human was going to drive so you could sort of almost consider this it was a human caused

SPEAKER_60: error even though the robo taxi is the one okay so then we need to uh alex answer two questions for

Chamath Palihapitiya: each of these who caused the accident who was primarily responsible like so share of responsibility

SPEAKER_05: in this case 100 the human and then the reaction how good was the reaction was the reaction human level better than human or less than human so here we have caused by human reaction undetermined

SPEAKER_31: i actually really like jason's framing here who was responsible and how good could humans do i think that's a good test the thing is just it just feels a little bit dated to me i don't mean to be contrary but to me having watched humans drive my entire life as a pedestrian and as a driver uh i just i wonder if we need to ask the question could humans do better because i bet you ten dollars that the answer is no

Chamath Palihapitiya: not on average we we need to really be on top of this and i think our job here on the program is to call the balls and strikes and really do our diligence to understand each one you know if we look at the cruise accident the fact that they tried to cover it up means they should have been penalized in this case zooks probably should get a high five for you know this might be a case where we can put it in the bucket of you know not bad actor but good actor and not neutral so i'm putting

SPEAKER_05: this one in the you know it's preliminary but i'm putting it in the in the good bucket yeah like i

SPEAKER_100: said i think this is what we want we we want accidents that no one gets hurt but that alert

SPEAKER_60: us to a possible flaw in the system that we can then reprogram and reconsider like this is exactly

SPEAKER_00: what you'd want to happen i also want um i'm as the president of the internet i'm going to or as president uh in when's the next election 2028 uh as your as jcal 2028 i'm signing an executive order

SPEAKER_03: that all self-driving cars have to publicly release the video within 24 hours of an accident if there

SPEAKER_05: is a person getting hit obviously blur it out if it's too graphic but people should be able to see it with the freedom of information act or after seeing it actually after seeing a disclaimer maybe

SPEAKER_07: blurring out the person's face it's you know like if even if i got hit by a car i would want people to

SPEAKER_09: see it to know the truth i'm trying to think about a privacy issue but you might want to blur out my

SPEAKER_114: face and not say my anonymously but i think it's an executive order somebody you know that's that's

SPEAKER_115: that's my uh fourth executive order as president yeah all right to back up my my idea though i i

SPEAKER_31: went through zooks's safety site and they didn't have as much information as i was expecting because i'm so spoiled by waymo they talk a lot about their safety plan their features but they don't have as much data and so they don't graph it as well here is information from waymo safety site as of this morning showing the difference in crash rates between waymos and human drivers in three markets across three different metrics if you're listening to the audio it tracks airbag deployment uh any injury reported in a collision or if there was a police report and across those three metrics for example in phoenix in san francisco waymos have essentially 83 percent fewer airbag deployments with some air bar in there than human drivers so to me the data is pretty stark that even today these cars are doing better than the average joe that doesn't mean they don't need to do better that doesn't mean we shouldn't have high aspirations but the comparison between could a human do better or

SPEAKER_118: maybe i'm being too futuristic here but i feel like we've already answered that question well i think it

SPEAKER_56: needs to be five times better this is showing twice as good i think for the mass population to want

SPEAKER_05: these to be deployed widely yeah i think it needs to be 5x at least three but that's just my personal

SPEAKER_09: belief i you know based on being a technologist for 30 years i i mean i also think yeah like there are

SPEAKER_100: some obvious advantages that should allow us to make them that much better like once we get the

SPEAKER_97: programming right once we get the technology working right it's going to be a hundred percent like a human you could be distracted you're on your phone you just got coffee like a million things

SPEAKER_100: can happen not not as much once we perfect the computer system it's perfected yeah great job uh

SPEAKER_05: zooks are riding without human drivers so the only two people without human drivers currently are waymo and zooks i believe in the united states cruise was doing them without humans they're no longer doing it

David Friedberg: so i think that's the only thing going on right now all right founders let's talk about your

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Chamath Palihapitiya: purchase that's squarespace.com twist i believe we need federal regulations that say for year one and a first million miles first 10 000 trips you know pretty high benchmark but not unreasonable there's a safety driver just because the cost of an accident if this accident had resulted in

SPEAKER_00: one of the cars then jumping the sidewalk and killing grandma zooks is done for maybe forever and self-driving in that particular city is over for years all it takes is one of these to hop the curb even if it's not their fault and you know somebody's puppy or somebody's grandma or god forbid a

SPEAKER_09: you know a baby stroller the the ultimate you know like bad pr you know baby stroller gets hit by zooks

SPEAKER_31: game over no more zooks but i do hope that our collective you know worrying doesn't slow down the progress here because to me and i i sound a little bit like mark andreason in his um let's go faster essay but it does feel to me that if we slow down a technology that's going to save so many lives of human drivers on the road or human pastors on the road yeah yeah yeah to me it's just like come on now and i'll say oh let's keep moving yep all right moving on what is the next

SPEAKER_22: most important story alex i think it's the nso group story okay let's think it's incredibly important

SPEAKER_31: okay so back in 2019 meta uncovered a exploit on whatsapp it's very popular multi-billion user social networking and messaging service this eventually led to about 1400 people in india being impacted by nso groups pegasus spyware nso group if you don't know makes hacking tools that allows governments and other groups to break into phones that are even locked down very secure like ios and meta was pretty mad about this it ended up in a suit and nso group lost that suit last year the news this week jason is that a jury has come back and awarded damages it's about a half million dollars in quote compensatory damages to meta and then also another 167 million dollars worth of punitive damages in this case that just means here's a fine so you don't do this again nso group is making some noise that it may not be able to pay this fee but i really just think that this is a good reminder that ruining people's cyber security activists journalists lawyers in democracies is a bad act and you should not do that and i i'm very hardened by this i wish there was a

SPEAKER_92: zero on the on final number there jason but i view this as a very positive step towards individual

SPEAKER_77: digital privacy your thoughts the fact that nso failed to provide the evidence like the source code of

Chamath Palihapitiya: pegasus spyware tells you everything this there are uh security companies that do black hat stuff like let you crack into encryption crack into people's phones do all kinds of stuff they generally

SPEAKER_09: are not here in the united states they're usually in places like israel or other countries yeah and we should if you are the platform whether it's apple or it's meta you should fight these and because you

Chamath Palihapitiya: want to fight for your users and what's right it it's terrible that people can use these encrypted services to do bad things in the world but we can't have everybody give up their basic human right to

SPEAKER_09: privacy and so you gotta take the good with the bad you shouldn't be able to backdoor these things

SPEAKER_100: all humans deserve privacy the end it feels like in technology sometimes there's this idea that once

SPEAKER_97: something exists it becomes inevitable like that's it we have to just give up on trying to regulate it it's out there in the world it's going to exist and i feel like it's nice every once in a while to have a reminder that just because something is possible does not mean we should not regulate it and just let it happen like you still do need to have some rules for the world to make sense can i read part of

SPEAKER_150: the meta statement here because i this is just the wording here is so funny they call nso a quote

SPEAKER_31: notorious foreign spyware merchant um to pay damages because it just the language here is nuts malicious industry against their illegal acts i mean meta seems really really really mad i want to make one more tiny point before we move on the nso group always stands up whenever it gets in trouble and it's like you know we catch terrorists so whenever these stories break it's never terrorists that we're being spied on it's always like little journalists activists ngos jeff bezos's paper so i

SPEAKER_54: just think that maybe we don't need this technology to exist maybe we just don't want it maybe just a big goal no that would be lovely to see all right let's talk about the uber story all right uber q1 jason

SPEAKER_31: revenue 11.53 billion 83 cents per share in earnings monthly active customers 14 growth year-over-year trips 18 14 revenue growth year-over-year 17 in constant currency and the company had 1.8 billion in net income 1.9 billion in adjusted ebitda and this blew my mind free cash flow in the quarter of 2.25 billion up 66 year-over-year so naturally wall street hated it and sent the shares down a couple

SPEAKER_09: of points yeah it's down two bucks um the thing is it had a crazy run up the last week which i was out

SPEAKER_00: of town and you know i don't check it every day but i was like wait a second like a month ago we were down in the 65 zone and then all of a sudden we almost hit the record high you know 80 87 is the

SPEAKER_05: record high for uber and it hit like and they can intraday trading 86 50 or something yesterday it was over 86 yeah yeah so it's basically i think the consensus is that this company has geographic distribution and obviously i'm talking my book here but they have geographic distribution they have business resiliency because they're in multiple business lines freight rides food and delivery other issue is robo taxis would they get killed by robo taxis and i think people answer that question with waymo is having a spectacular time in austin with uber the utilization of ubers in austin is 99 more utilization than human drivers in other words if a human driver like if if these waymos are doing probably 15 rides a day is my guess maybe they could hit 20 there aren't many drivers 99 out of 100

SPEAKER_00: drivers don't do that what that means is wait times are going to go down the availability is going

Chamath Palihapitiya: to go up if you live outside of austin you might wait 10 minutes to 20 minutes for an uber everybody's had that experience when they're on vacation or they're out of a city center you're going to have the city center experience of what we called um uber unos back in the day i came up with this term for when you get one in one minute i would always send a picture to travis and william and ryan like oh i got an uber uno they also did the volkswagen deal they're now up to like 15 partnerships with on autonomy companies the volkswagen deal is going to be the game changer i predict volkswagen is the number two car producer in the world we're going to need 10 to 20 million cars per year for a decade to put a dent into the number of rides people want to take the volkswagen bus i think

SPEAKER_09: will be the number one would they call it the id bus they should just call it the volkswagen

SPEAKER_162: bus because that's what it is this cool car it's big it's awesome it's got like seven seats have you seen it has sliding doors i've seen it uh i haven't seen a person yet but i have seen it

Chamath Palihapitiya: all over you're talking about like two captain's chairs two captain's chairs and then a three-person bench the captain shares can move around but you can easily get to the third bench because the second row is two captain's chairs like you can get on a model x that configuration is seven people so there it is and it's a beautiful car these things are going to be everywhere and robo taxes will be everywhere waymos will be everywhere and waymo just did a deal with toyota to provide their self-driving

SPEAKER_97: cars yeah that's another part of this story is all of the self-driving partnerships i mean you mentioned volkswagen just this year uber ubers also announced deals with pony ai we ride momenta may mobility uh waymo and nvidia so like that's all happening simultaneously yeah yeah their partnerships

SPEAKER_28: team is working overtime send them more coffee somebody yeah but jason to your point about uh the

SPEAKER_31: number of cars that we need i know we're talking about drops in the bucket here but stories in the last i think two or three days had zoox ramping up production of its cars and also waymo working to expand its fleet of 1500 jaguar ipaces or whatever they're called yeah we're seeing momentum right now to get from triple to you know four digits and then i think we'll be at five to display by the end

SPEAKER_81: of this year if you're a startup you need to sign up for notion right now go to notion.com twist and sign up for free using my code twist notion.com twist here at my venture firm launch and my podcast all in this week in startups we put everything into notion it also has an amazing database function and it does crm for us it does okrs for us it does timelines it's basically our single source for all of our information and data everything in one space one price simple powerful beautifully designed the design at notion is award winning and notion can seamlessly transition from a workplace power tool into a game changer for your personal life i got a couple different properties i got a ski house i got a ranch i got another apartment all of that is contained in a notion instance for my family offices you can get started for free at notion.com twist that's notion.com twist to start free take the first step towards making your life organized and productive the number one communication tool in the world in my estimation is notion notion.com twist we say five you mean ten thousand or more cars yes

Chamath Palihapitiya: which if they're doing 20 rides a day is not a drop in the bucket currently ride sharing is one percent of rides here in the united states or slightly less and then globally it's less than one percent so i believe we get to 30 of rides 20 to 30 of rides in 10 years is my estimate but good for the uber team other piece that i thought was particularly good was uber now is saying back to the office but three days a week and previous employees who were remote yeah no more remote you still have to come to the office three percent it got a little con uh testy i guess on a all hands meeting people are still doing these all

SPEAKER_09: hand meetings where people could just ask any question they want i think that was like i think

SPEAKER_176: we're going to see those go away they don't seem to be very popular like they used to be i mean when

SPEAKER_00: everything's going up into the right and you have a small company and everybody's got a ton of stock i think it's one thing to have these when you start getting into hundreds of thousands or 50 000 employees and some number of them are not going to become billionaires or millionaires based on their

SPEAKER_03: equity yeah you might get a little uh uh brush back on an issue like this but here's my advice go find another remote job okay there's other jobs in the world yeah i think part of it too if you're

SPEAKER_100: gonna have an all-hands meeting to adjust a a controversial decision against all of your employees

SPEAKER_97: you might want to have a better line than if you're here for a sabbatical and this change causes

SPEAKER_56: you to change your mind it is what it is there's two different issues one is he did say in person

Chamath Palihapitiya: we get more results we have good results now we need to get to great so that was what he said about the um in work thing the sabbatical thing you know he said like you can take a month off in eight years

SPEAKER_182: if that's what you are here for is the sabbatical like whatever i don't even understand why companies have a sabbatical i never got offered a sabbatical yeah saying the reason we want you to the reason we want

SPEAKER_97: to be here is to impact the company we recognize some of these changes are going to be unpopular

SPEAKER_31: with folks this is a risk we decided to take the pendulum has really swung here from employee power to employer power this is what a manifestation of that the the daryl point jason about goods not good enough we have to be great i think dovetails neatly with what the ceo of fiverr was saying because his argument is that we have to be basically using ai all over the place now forget hiring more people

SPEAKER_03: you need to be upscaling yourself so he sent an email just to put more context on it fiverr is a let's always explain what the company does in case people don't know fiverr is a marketplace where you

SPEAKER_00: theoretically spend five bucks to get something done like a micro task i need an image i need a press release so throw somebody a fiverr you know five quid or whatever uh and they and they do some work for you five pounds whatever so he wrote an email to the entire company i don't know the time stamp of this but this sounds like one of those 1am ceo like manic emails that i send yeah the grammar

SPEAKER_193: is there a time on it i'm going to guess two in the morning one there's not a not a time stamp

SPEAKER_197: on it but like oh yeah 12 12 58 but not we don't have am or pm no it's am 100 100 trust me when

SPEAKER_05: you're a ceo here's what happens yeah you work all day you work all week you're in panic mode you're like we need we have competitors things are changing trump tariff chaos uh recession whatever it is ai replacing jobs marketplace competition and then you decide to write a missive all good

SPEAKER_03: missives a missive can only be written after the stroke of midnight this one will be no different

SPEAKER_97: just like jerry maguire oh is that what happened in jerry maguire yeah he stays up all night and he

SPEAKER_31: writes his manifesto yeah oh okay great okay so what did he what did he say well he says that no matter your role no matter your job even his job as ceo ai is coming for it so what is the solution to that personally led learning he wants you to try tinker fail learn and collaborate with how to use these ai tools echoing i think very closely what toby from shopify said that the way to get better with ai is to use it a lot it's a tool um i really liked how he said this he said i'm paraphrasing here a little bit what was easy is now zero what was hard is now easy what was impossible is now merely hard so essentially everything has become easier which means people need to take on more and then he concludes the letter with saying essentially don't come to me for more staff if you're not

SPEAKER_168: using ai tools very aggressively again mirroring what shopify and other leaders have said i think

SPEAKER_03: this is tough from the fiverr ceo because a lot of love i'll tell you if as a leader and as somebody

Chamath Palihapitiya: who works with leaders of companies right now there is deep panic in the executive suite right now across all companies it's an elevated situation because of the the economy the recession trump tariffs all this stuff combined with ai hitting at the same time now for every opportunity to go faster

SPEAKER_05: hire less people maybe even trim staffs and costs you also need to have people be willing to embrace these tools i'm finding it very hard myself to get people to embrace these tools i have many people

SPEAKER_03: come to me and they have a problem and i'm like they didn't type the question they're saying out loud to me into check gpt first or gemini it has led to me in terms of my mentorship with people getting them to be ai first it's just like getting people to be online first internet first mobile first as a leader you have to push people and some people will just not do the paradigm shift in business and then you have to fire them you have to fight with them you've got to push people it's so hard to be in management yeah that's why you get paid a lot more because you have to worry about these issues

SPEAKER_100: i do think it's interesting uh and it i i think something that's sort of a positive in this we used

SPEAKER_97: to talk about ai taking everybody's job that was the concern it was like you're going to lose your job to ai is going to be able to do exactly what you do and this is part of a lot of different even the ai warnings now are like people are going to get better at working with ai and they're gonna take your job like it's not about being replaced completely it's about you having to complement

SPEAKER_100: the skills you already have at least that's how people are talking about it now is that what's really going to happen who knows but i do think it's a positive sign that we're discussing ai just

SPEAKER_97: completely running everything less and it's more like human plus ai is going to be running everything

SPEAKER_31: okay so how does the rubber beat the road here so the ceo of fiverr posted an update his memo was about a month ago we're talking about today because he just dropped news about how his company reacted to this one thing he said jason was that he's going to open his calendar for folks to literally come by and pitch him ideas about how to use ai to make the company better and as a response to his email and those meetings he said the following thing we're already rebuilding how we work and velocity matters more now than ever transitioning to a modular architecture using ai to refactor legacy code auto generate documentation and power custom workspaces across teams everyone must strive to automate their manual work freeing up time for his thinking critical decisions and creative problem

SPEAKER_213: solving essentially letting people be more more human and less robotic so this back's a long point

SPEAKER_97: that satya nadella that the microsoft ceo i wish i had the clip in front of me but he he gave an interview like two months ago where he said exactly this like everybody needs to shift their thinking to be how much it's not ai is going to take my job it's how much more productive will i be able to be if i complement everything i'm doing with ai tools and potato potato though lon because if everyone's more

SPEAKER_31: efficient and you can do one person one human plus ai equals five prior humans doesn't that have the kind

SPEAKER_100: of the same impact sure i i it's it's it's not a change in what's going to happen it's a change in how we're talking about working with ai which it does strike me as it's a little bit more humanistic

SPEAKER_05: or it's a little bit more humane yes it is it's actually a very good insight people are not saying

Chamath Palihapitiya: we're going to replace you in the customer support department like they were saying earlier like all these discussions we're going to get rid of the customer support it's all going to be down to ai they're saying you know please be absolutely engaged with these tools so we don't have to replace you somebody say you're not going to be replaced by ai you're going to replace by somebody who uses ai yeah and i think that's the manifestation that's coming here we are in a position where labor does

SPEAKER_00: not have an offer from uber and coinbase those companies are getting smaller static team size as

SPEAKER_03: alex and i have been saying for two years now almost you don't need to add people you just need to use the tools and you will get 30 more efficient a year whether it's coding sales etc so here we are you need to get your button gear and if you're a young person get into office and if you're running your company and you're raising venture capital or you're a venture firm raising your next fund part of the reason i'm raising i'm getting everybody back in offices i want to have an easier time raising my next fund when i raised the last fund they asked me are you in person literally i would say four out of five lps asked me that so they believe in in-person culture uh and now what am i doing here every tuesday in austin we started in person tuesdays with founders we're inviting our entire portfolio to come every tuesday 48 tuesdays a year to get mentorship to come to talks to have lunch and to do jam sessions with us why we we want them to win that's it's as simple as that folks you know if you want to win and you're up against a company a remote company up against an in-person company the in-person

SPEAKER_220: company wins nine out of ten times okay let's uh we have i think we have office hours we do we do

SPEAKER_31: we do so today we're having fusion ads i think it's time to forget talking about models and frameworks instead let's talk about how ai is actually meeting the road today and in this case

SPEAKER_213: we're talking about a marketing context jason so please welcome evan garage from fusion ads

Chamath Palihapitiya: evan welcome to the program um can you show the audience what you're doing or does it exist as a

SPEAKER_224: product yet or are you still in the laboratory oh no it exists and we're generating revenue we can show

Chamath Palihapitiya: it yes okay great i think you know sometimes a picture or a video or a tour is worth a thousand bucks so show us what you're working on here because it is really interesting to think about the promise of ai ads i saw um linkedin co-founder reed hoffman talking about how so much consumer surplus has been created by google maps they said something like three thousand dollars per person who uses google maps and that wouldn't exist as a consumer surplus if advertising didn't make it free so

SPEAKER_228: here we go can you guys see my screen we do yes sir great so remember most people are listening so

SPEAKER_231: describe what they're seeing yeah perfect uh so in short fusion ads is basically a marketing ai agent that increases revenue for small businesses by instantly generating like professional ads that improve return on investment um and so what i'm showing here is you've already registered you've logged in and this is the home screen okay of the back end and you what i think is the easiest thing to describe is that when you come here you simply ask to put in your url or put in athena wow um well i have some campaigns that are ready here so i think it would be several steps if we just put in a in a url but yes we can do that i like a live demo batter bummer well this is a live demo it's

SPEAKER_09: just we set up a campaign so no i know but seeing the actual creation of an ad for something would be

SPEAKER_231: better but okay well we can do that next i mean here i wanted to quickly because basically you have to ask answer a few questions so what the questions that you need to answer is like what are you trying to achieve um do you have an image for the product you're trying to sell tell a little bit about who

Chamath Palihapitiya: your customers are okay so male female this age group and then you entered here ensure your home or business runs smoothly let's just read that the prompt you gave it ensure your home business runs smoothly with our top tier plumbing services from routine maintenance and leak repairs to complex

SPEAKER_32: installations and emergency assistant our certified plumber so you're giving it like a prompt about

SPEAKER_231: the business and what you're trying to achieve yeah i mean if you put in your url we'll scrape everything from your url and then you basically refine it to be like yep this is what so it might have

Chamath Palihapitiya: pulled that copy from the plumber's web page exactly ah okay even better so you don't have to write the

SPEAKER_231: prompt and we can do that test that you said just okay sure one but so basically then you select what

SPEAKER_115: channels you're trying to advertise so that would be facebook instagram twitter yep so the free channels

SPEAKER_231: of you know using your own existing social media or the paid advertising channels of meta google instagram google search and google display or we even generate sms's and emails for you to send yeah that's your own thing yeah so after you do this you you generate some designs um and it will ask you some questions so so i'll say no just because it's already here and it instantly generates ads for you

SPEAKER_05: while we're waiting i'll just are those okay so now we're seeing ads that you might see in instagram for keep your plumbing flowing smoothly it put the logo because we're going a little too fast here um you're seeing the logo of the company at the top there's a hero image of somebody working on plumbing is that hero image an ai generated image yeah so we it asked do you have an image we

SPEAKER_231: answered no if you do have an image for the product or we scraped it off of your catalog then you would already have the image there um so these are ai generated images they're a person working on a sink

SPEAKER_161: and then it's up to you to make sure you approve it that it's not like a weird picture right

SPEAKER_231: correct okay and you see i had clicked add design uh while we were just talking and it immediately

SPEAKER_00: added a new ad as we can you give it feedback on option l and say like um i noticed it's all white

SPEAKER_09: people one white woman two white men can you say give me more diversity in it or like i'm advertising to a different community uh you know that that sync is too fancy give me like a more a more popular sync

SPEAKER_231: right yes exactly right so um here you can click edit and you can go into like a you know canvas style editor or a manual editor yeah got it um and then uh you can also open up like the chat prompt on the right hand side which is more like you want to just give it unstructured feedback exactly like you just said like a prompt give me more diversity uh replace the image with someone of color uh rewrite

SPEAKER_255: this ad in spanish um and whatever other you know free text format that you want to give right and you

SPEAKER_158: and you do you tell it geographies as well because that would be a very interesting thing if you said

SPEAKER_09: i'm doing this in brooklyn and it said like oh downtown brooklyn or sunset park or bay ridge you know you could actually maybe even think about what the home cost is there and then you know one

SPEAKER_05: group could have kohler faucets the other one could have i don't know what the most generic one is like

SPEAKER_240: it could really start to do interesting things yeah yeah exactly so when you put in your website then we got what your address is and we know where you sell your products so that the the geo targeting that you're referring to we it's behind the scenes because we already know you have a store or you sell online if you and then who your target demographic is you have a store we know to geofence the paid ads within you know 15 miles of that particular store amazing um and then what i'm showing you is the ux but what

SPEAKER_231: will be uh launched next week is more of like just a chat and you can come in in a very unstructured way

SPEAKER_240: and chat with uh the agent just like you would chat with a freelancer that you hired on fiverr or your

SPEAKER_231: agency um and it will ask you whatever questions are missing in order for it to generate now you have

Chamath Palihapitiya: the ability to do many ads uh if you go to the facebook ad library for example you can look at com.com and they're really good at advertising or fitbot and you could see many different ad styles many different tests that they do with humans um but here can you just have the ai change my ads every six hours and spend 10 bucks on each one without me interfering and let it rip or do you should i

SPEAKER_240: not trust it yet uh you you cannot it's not 100 done for you um i think the next round that we will uh

SPEAKER_231: that we are seeking is specifically to scrape the 13 million ads that are publicly available on facebook and google and those will guide the agent that we have in our ai to produce better best performing ads

SPEAKER_255: for a given product geography uh market and you know industry how is the business going um tell me

SPEAKER_257: what are the challenges any blockers so we can do a little office hours here and people can hear an

SPEAKER_270: investor and a founder talk about the challenges and how we um how we resolve those so um traction is

SPEAKER_231: good we're about 16 000 mrr which is plus 30 34 month on month to hop up 143 uh since january um we spent a lot of time on product market fit um in targeting small businesses i think the main challenge for

SPEAKER_240: if going after that segment is that even though you give them tools to create their own ads they actually don't trust themselves that whatever ad is created is good enough so they want to outsource that to an agency or freelancer who's telling them that it is so that's a bit of a behavioral change and the solution to that is the done for you advertising loop that will close so that when we do put the ads

SPEAKER_230: live we are a b testing we use the performance results in order to give the agent back the feedback and it will automatically take them into consideration and generate what's the question then i mean i

SPEAKER_229: understand the challenge is there a question to it or do you want just me to riff on it uh i think

SPEAKER_273: riff on it i think we would love to hear how do we get more customers what to go best go to market

SPEAKER_77: so you have to meet your customers where they are you're doing something incredibly innovative with

SPEAKER_00: a group of people who are neophytes and are scared so you're like canva like canva was a product for people who didn't do graphic design let's pause for a second there it's a it's the number one graphic

SPEAKER_03: design tool in the world and they made a tool not for graphic designers what they did was they induced

SPEAKER_05: a market to exist right so there were there were people who wanted the output of graphic design but they didn't want to learn photoshop because once you start doing layers and all this stuff it's like okay i don't want to spend 100 hours doing this i just want to make a birthday invite my daughters nine years old my twins all they do is go on canva and make me funny things constantly print them out on the color printer and bring them to me it's hilarious um so i think you might be in the same boat you're a tool for local advertisers small advertisers medium-sized businesses that don't have an agency can't afford an agency but they want this so the tool's not ready to do everything it's 60 of the way there and that's not your fault you're in an innovative you're skating to where the

Chamath Palihapitiya: puck is going so i have an idea why don't we include in the price of the product human review so when grammarly first came out you know the program grammarly yeah there was a button in it because

SPEAKER_05: they were selling it to people who wanted proofreaders wanted an editor that said pay for a human review and then they had a bunch of freelancers look it up alex for me please if you can find the page that does that i don't know if they still do it and i thought well this is interesting i almost used it

Chamath Palihapitiya: because i was like yeah i'll pay uh 10 cents a word or it's like five cents a word okay it's a 500 word article and i'm going to pay 10 bucks to have reproofed why wouldn't i do that um and you could do it right in the product get a human review of that so here's what i want you to

SPEAKER_274: test tell them what is the product cost right now ballpark small business is 199 a month perfect

SPEAKER_00: so it's 199 a month with two hours of human review included and each additional hour of human review

Chamath Palihapitiya: is 35 an hour and you can talk to that person on chat or whatever and then i want you to hire uh a person maybe if you take a loss to do the human review and when you after they do everything they

SPEAKER_05: say click here to get human advice and it says connecting you to a human and it could be you or

SPEAKER_03: other people and then you do that piece for them and you call it like you make a couple of personas

SPEAKER_00: pick which persona you want this is you know johnny b good who does b2b sas you know who does enterprise stuff this is susie q susie q is really good at local businesses there's another person who's great at restaurants and you say pick the reviewer you want and you make five personas and you say this

SPEAKER_09: person's 35 an hour this person's 45 an hour this person's 60 an hour uh and then done you're a

Chamath Palihapitiya: startup you got to get people over the finish line so when i had a company density.io you can look it up density.io was uh doing installations of uh people counting machines and it was just always a blocker who was going to install these machines and how would it work and you know they just started incorporating the installation in some cases into the purchase price then they started charging on a square foot basis because it was too confusing and there was too much friction so you have a little

SPEAKER_05: bit of friction right now people get 80 of the way there but they're scared so you can just manually do it until they can do it they might say you know what i can do this myself now because when you made the ads better and you said oh i want some diversity in the ads and i you know there's five there's six

Chamath Palihapitiya: fingers on that person's hand and you know maybe we should do um more specific brands of plumbing

SPEAKER_05: items you know you can they'll be like i know how to do that so you kind of tell them here's what we did we checked x y and z we checked this and you have like a checklist read the book checklist manifesto

Chamath Palihapitiya: shout out checklist manifest you do a checklist of what humans check so we check the spelling we check the image we checked for offensive material we checked for crisp communication we checked the uh call to action and we changed the call to action it said book now we said learn more so we want you to test

SPEAKER_240: learn more instead of book now get the idea yeah the latter we do the former we don't i like the idea of

SPEAKER_231: adding um the human touch into it and including it in a bundle and that gets over the fear that

SPEAKER_255: um you know what if the product doesn't do xyz and i at least want to talk to someone and then they get reassured and keep going i think paul graham wrote do things that don't scale i think there

SPEAKER_05: was an essay he did do things that don't scale in year one and then you figure out how to scale them if that's what people want did you find that grammarly thing by chance i did so notably and this

SPEAKER_31: was to my surprise jason it was called the expert writing service and it was discontinued january 34th of this year they kept doing that for that long i had i thought you were actually wrong to be honest i'm like they don't do that i've never seen it turns out i was wrong so yeah that ticket killed off and paul graham's do things that don't scale essay came out in july 2013 we'll

SPEAKER_03: have that in the show notes okay great so evan i think that's what you do um and um how many unique customers do you have using the product right now about 9 000 right now okay how many are paying oh i need to look it up yeah so some fraction of those are users i would suggest no users only paid

SPEAKER_255: right now we do seven day free trial and then it converts to paid after seven days that might be okay

SPEAKER_09: um you know maybe like it doesn't let you publish or whatever you can you know do the ad editor and then they can like take a screenshot of it but they can't maybe they can get up to a certain point in it

SPEAKER_05: and then it pushes them to pay but you might want to get more people on the phone and instead of going for the vanity 9 000 number maybe we go for the velocity of paid customers and then the understanding

SPEAKER_09: who our ideal customer profile is and the quality of the revenue so hey we had a thousand people

SPEAKER_05: asked to do a phone call and onboard this month we're literally getting 30 people a day we're onboarding uh 10 of them based on their needs we tell them it's good for them and then of those 300

Chamath Palihapitiya: uh that paid 199 a month like then you got a real business so i almost feel like you need to understand these customers more and why they're doing it and you might be falling back on the trap of the high number the big number with a comma in it i would much rather you see see you have nine paid customers right now using the product and getting value then 9 000 and we're not sure if they're actually getting bad and then i'd like to see the nine every month double so 9 to 18 to 40 to 80 and then

SPEAKER_05: you're going to learn as an organization what you need to staff that level of customer and you don't

Chamath Palihapitiya: need to be efficient they don't need to be profitable right now you could be losing 200 on every customer

SPEAKER_09: as long as they're using it and getting value and that that's really where i think really high quality investors like a sequoia or you know a pair vc whoever it is that you know they're going to look at your engagement stats they're going to talk to your customers before they invest so you want to have 10 reference clients that just shut up about this okay makes sense thank you all right well done

Chamath Palihapitiya: uh great job evan and uh hopefully i will see you in austin for barbecue soon come see lon and myself

SPEAKER_257: and jackie in austin and the team we're going to be doing founder tuesdays where are you based i'm in

SPEAKER_286: tampa and i do go to houston so um perfect you're not that far we're doing uh founder tuesdays at the

SPEAKER_147: office so startup tuesdays jam sessions all right great job evan thank you so much great to meet you

SPEAKER_168: go thanks evan we're going to quickly talk about founder fridays jason's favorite thing in the entire

SPEAKER_294: world we have lawn a very special matchup we do we uh a little we're throwing you a little curveball

SPEAKER_97: here jason we've got we've got our final four just as a reminder to everybody osprey from houston texas med simple from florianapolis brazil taktun from yerevan armenia mom sub from chicago uh illinois but

SPEAKER_100: team launch like so many of these companies they came to us and they said hey we've got two companies we want to give them a second chance we want to do a wild card round and end up with a final five

SPEAKER_97: not a final four so we are we're gonna we're gonna do it we're gonna we're gonna go with it we're bringing back two of our favorite two launches favorite then how do the five then go down to don't we're just gonna worry we've got a whole plan for how the final five we're gonna pick a winner out of these final five but first for today here is our wild card second chance bracket verbal from philadelphia versus arcana from los angeles okay let's let's start bringing it back

SPEAKER_100: let's pick we're gonna start with verbal just as a quick reminder to you both this is the wellness app they use hypnotherapy to help you modify your behavior improve your outlook and change your life

SPEAKER_305: here's the real thing hypnotherapy is real yeah i'm alexandra the ceo at verbal and our biggest

SPEAKER_307: need right now is money to market verbal we plan to spend fifty thousand dollars a month in paid advertising pr and partnerships you asked about our two-year plan we'll hear the numbers year one is about laying a solid foundation to build upon that's why we're investing in people process product year two is an exciting year we turn a profit and how do we do it because we leverage what we did in year one by year five we're looking to implement our exit strategy because we're so profitable that people are going to want to buy us in fact we have feed-to-feed grants wearables vr ar and we're available in every language okay i hate the last part you never big mistake

Chamath Palihapitiya: big faux pas in startup land is to say you want to exit early that means it's not your life's work which i think it is her life's work so that is a bit of a tell we don't want you to sell we want you to go public and this company to exist for all times what companies do i talk about all the time i talk about robin hood i talk about uber they're not going anywhere folks those companies will be around after i'm gone that's what we're looking for so a little full power there at the end but i do like her energy uh and i do like the space and i think people will pay a lot for hypnotherapy because you can do things like quitting smoking or hypnotherapy for birthing classes or losing weight or getting off drugs and alcohol or a gambling addiction yeah i believe pre-flop or not folding

SPEAKER_319: pre-flop enough according to the million dollar cash game and alan keating's hypnotherapist absolutely he

SPEAKER_03: did alex keating my friend um started doing hypnotherapy because he was playing too many

SPEAKER_320: cards and to improve his poker game that's wild wow he did it like the days before and morning of

SPEAKER_00: and it really impacted his play when he won big because he was playing too many bad hands and didn't

SPEAKER_03: have the ability to fold and so they did hypnotherapy fold you have jack five awesome

SPEAKER_178: i mean that's crazy that you can have that kind of a subtle impact on your thinking you know like

SPEAKER_97: quit smoking or something that's a that's a big daily habit but just i fold to or don't fold enough

SPEAKER_330: when i play poker it's very specific is enough lawn that's what i need yeah that's what i need it's

SPEAKER_331: like get some get a medium pizza not a large alex don't need to read the nq

SPEAKER_335: like nicola that's going out of business you can't stop me

SPEAKER_97: okay give me the other one lightning round we're going back to l.a uh my old hometown and arcana these guys have developed a method by which developers can integrate relevant text ads into their ai outputs so let's take a look at their oh i'm loving this here arcana a content-based ad

SPEAKER_347: serving platform for jenny and fruit let's start with a quick demo in this demo we see arcana seamlessly integrate contextual ads directly within the response generated by a gen ai application creating potential to monetize every llm interaction uh we think i think arcana has a bright future ahead of us

SPEAKER_349: especially though back in this next two years we're going to expanding into agent agent services ad placement beyond the gen ai space and expanding the points of contact between the advertiser and the end user overall the results are are simple increasing customer engagement right only the end user time on that all while decreasing advertiser points of contact and experience overall we're confident the future is bright and we think in all honesty this is just the tip of the iceberg the same way they google and double click expanded did the massive pipeline of kind of online content we believe this is the first step to doing some big civil thank you

Chamath Palihapitiya: all right if these two lunatics will go to an office instead of working in their their uh studio apartments uh this is a real winner i would invest in it i they if they can get into a war room with the three or four people who are working on this and a sales person grinding it out i love this idea i've been saying this from the beginning i think google's got a bright future in advertising with gemini if they choose to take it which is as you're reading your results they did it aggressively highlighting words in the results that hit the relevant ads that could work or i was literally talking to sergey brin at the all in uh f1 event he was our surprise guest on stage and i said to him

SPEAKER_03: like why don't have in the sidebar a running list of ads and offers for me based on all of my queries so i'm doing a query about f1 and it's showing me hey f1 tickets f1 merchandise f1 subscription uh this fame the number one book for f1 and it's just and then i and i could they could fade away like

SPEAKER_09: every 10 seconds they fade away unless i say don't fade away and i pause it so they just run in i think there's a huge future here i like hypnotherapy i love the ads in language model i'm going ads and language model for my wild card choice what have you got lon uh you know not to make it uh not as

SPEAKER_97: exciting but yeah i i'm i'm with you 100 i think arcana is it's an amazing concept it's an amazing product like it makes so much sense when you see it like of course there's so many interactions that are happening we've been talking about it all episode there's so many ai interactions happening constantly every day and it knows so much about you the ai is learning so much about you and what you're looking for at that's part of how it works so of course it's going to learn how to market things

SPEAKER_31: and sell things to you what do you got love the verbal video have to make it three zero however because i recently talked to profound a startup on the twist 500 they're doing search engine optimization for generative ai they call it geo anyways i just got to dive into this market how big ai surges and so forth so to me there's more money to be made with arcana i got to give it to them even though i will say maybe point the camera down so we don't see your whole closet in the background but you know

SPEAKER_12: it's all good get your butts in an office on in austin get an office at capital factory next to us

SPEAKER_237: and yeah you might get a 2500 25k check from us so great job everybody with the wild card so now that

SPEAKER_100: we've got five finalists here's what we're going to do next we're sending these five companies to the launch investment team they are going to apply your rigorous method for evaluating the potential of

SPEAKER_97: startups including answering the two key questions why will this succeed and why will this fail based on those responses we're going to pick a top two they're going to come on this weekend startups live love it face off and that's how we will crown archie we need to do a summer tournament of this

SPEAKER_05: get everybody who is in founder friday stoked about it yeah and uh let all of our portfolio companies

SPEAKER_00: know and uh let's learn from this one what worked what didn't and let's do the uh summer startup cup

SPEAKER_09: here on this weekend service twist prize twist cup founder fridays finals i don't know come up with a good name and uh we will see you all next time on this weekend startups we call it twist bye bye bye